Ryan Nece is the only player in NFL history to win a Super Bowl as a rookie and go 0-16 in his final season.
His dad, Hall of Famer Ronnie Lott, started one of the first athlete-backed venture funds with Joe Montana in the late â90s. After retirement, Ryan took everything he learned and rebuilt that playbook a generation later.
Today, Ryan runs Next Legacy, a $4 billion fund of funds that connects athletes and philanthropists with the top venture capital firms in the world. Almost nobody is better positioned to explain how athletes have quietly broke in to Silicon Valley.
We get into similarities of the Power Law in sports and venture, what separates the top 0.01% of athletes, the dumbest investments heâs watched athletes make, why having âa guyâ is usually the first trap, the rule of three that gets an LPâs attention when raising a fund, the two kinds of AI that give you an edge, the âNext Playâ mindset he learned from his dad, and why Next Legacy gives every dollar of profit from their flagship fund to charity.
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Timestamps to jump in:
0:00 How a football family broke into Silicon Valley
4:33 A Super Bowl rookie year with four Hall of Famers
8:09 What separates the top 0.1% of athletes?
12:18 The mistake of having "a guy"
18:41 Vetting who to trust
20:18 The dumbest investments athletes make
22:45 How athletes can help founders
29:44 VC Power Law is just like sports
34:24 How to break in without connections
38:05 What Next Legacy actually is
40:44 Why they give away all the profits
43:20 Early firm building mistakes
48:19 Learning to pitch institutional LP's
53:03 The emerging-manager barbell
55:45 âYour starting five tells me who you areâ
57:47 The other AI: Authentic Interaction
59:55 Getting LP attention with the rule of three
1:03:40 Working the whisper network
1:06:03 Pick the kid who gets picked last
1:12:26 The Lions 0-16 season
1:14:43 The âNext Playâ mindset
1:19:28 Mental toughness
1:21:32 What itâs like commentating an NFL game
1:27:14 Getting cussed out by Warren Sapp
1:31:13 His favorite athlete: Jerry Rice
1:35:15 Abe Lincoln and his grandfather's restaurants
Referenced:
Book: Give and Take on Amazon
Book: Three Feet From from Gold on Amazon
Book: Team of Rivals on Amazon
Find Ryan on LinkedIn
đ Stream on YouTube, Spotify, and Apple
Transcript
Find transcripts of all prior episodes here.
Turner Novak:
Ryan, welcome to the show.
Ryan Nece:
I love it. Iâm glad to be here, brother. Appreciate you having me.
Turner Novak:
So the fund you run is called Next Legacy. I think I saw you guys have $3.6 billion in AUM. Is that the right number? Thatâs what the internet told me.
Ryan Nece:
Thatâs what the internet... You know, itâs wrong. Itâs not always accurate. Actually, weâre closer to $4 billion now, which is kind of crazy. Itâs a testament to some recent performance. Weâve grown significantly.
Turner Novak:
Thatâs great. Itâs always good to grow. One thing weâll talk about later, youâre kind of running the same playbook your dad ran. You ran it back. You guys are both athletes who played in the NFL. How do most athletes start getting into venture? And how did you initially get in, and how does it go?
Ryan Nece:
Out of respect for my father, I would say he is an elite athlete, and I was an athlete. He had a Hall of Fame career. He won four Super Bowls. He likes to remind me of that, and I only won one Super Bowl. So he is the elite athlete in the family.
One of the things I was very fortunate about, growing up around my father, is that my parents had me young. So I got a chance to be around him, be around the locker room, be around incredible players, and watch these elite athletes perform. I got to watch how my father walked and talked and moved to become one of the greatest safeties of all time.
When youâre around excellence, around winners and champions who have deep conviction about how they approach their craft, thatâs a privilege. Because you learn what it takes. I got a chance to grow up around that, and to watch my father transition away from sport.
Fortunately for him, he was drafted by the 49ers and was here in the Bay Area. While their team was succeeding, all of a sudden you had this amazing place called Silicon Valley on the rise. So he started to meet a lot of the men and women that laid the foundation of whatâs made this place so magical. He found great mentors, and he started to invest. He started making more money off the field than he did on the field.
All of a sudden he realized, in the late â90s, there arenât athletes investing in venture capital, and theyâre definitely not Black men. So why donât I create something? He partnered with a couple of his former teammates, Harris Barton and Joe Montana, and they created a fund to give athletes the opportunity to work with some of the most iconic venture firms.
I got a chance to be around that. I remember getting dragged to meetings and sitting in coffee shops, because thatâs what everybody does in the Bay Area. Thankfully, back then I didnât have an iPhone or an iPad to distract me. My dad would make me take notes. I remember being in meetings with incredible people and getting a chance to listen to the future. I started drinking the Kool-Aid pretty quickly. I was fascinated with technology.
I was always fascinated with entrepreneurship. When I was at UCLA, my father was still building his firm, and I started investing. I was looking at Cisco and Juniper Networks and Intel and all these different companies. Iâm definitely aging myself, but...
Turner Novak:
Those were cutting edge back then.
Ryan Nece:
Cutting edge back then. And I wasnât sure if I was going to play in the NFL. I was having a great career at UCLA playing football, but I was also thinking about life after sport. I was lucky enough to go to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers after my days at UCLA, and I started my career. We won a Super Bowl my first year in Tampa, which was incredible. It was really special to walk into a defense that arguably was one of the best of all time. The reason you can say that is the players that were in that huddle.
We had four Hall of Famers on one defense. You had John Lynch and Warren Sapp and Derrick Brooks and Ronde Barber, and you could argue Simeon Rice. Thatâs incredible, to line up with those guys and learn what true professionalism is and what a high standard is.
I quickly knew I probably wasnât going to have the long, tenured career my father had. So in my off-seasons, I was taking classes at Harvard and Stanford, trying to learn about life after ball. I did some unique hacks where Iâd build connectivity with leaders in the city. I joined the board of the major nonprofits in the area, because I felt if I could learn a crash course in business and how these large, multimillion dollar nonprofits are run...
Turner Novak:
You had a zoo, I think, on your LinkedIn. Did I see that?
Ryan Nece:
In Tampa Bay? Yeah, I was at the Tampa Bay Lowry Park Zoo for a while. I knew very little about a zoo, but I learned a lot, getting a chance to be around all these business leaders and people that had a heart for giving.
Then I launched my own foundation while I was playing. Weâre celebrating 20 years of our foundation, headquartered in Tampa, and weâre going to do work here in California in the Bay Area as well. So I constantly was trying to find my way into really special huddles.
After I was done playing, and I know youâre in Michigan and have some roots there, my last year in the NFL I was with the Detroit Lions. You and I were joking before the show, I think Iâm the only person in NFL history to win a Super Bowl in his first year and go 0-16 in his last year. I donât know if itâs something to be proud about, but needless to say, itâs incredible perspective.
To be on one of the best teams and one of the worst teams. After I was done, I was like, âWhat am I going to do?â I thought I was going to go work at my fatherâs firm. They sold the firm the year I retired, so I went to a family office for two years. I left there to co-found a business and built a startup. That brought me back into the world of tech, and we built that for four and a half years, and then we were acquired by Fox Sports. At that point I decided not to stay and do the earn-out. I decided to go launch our firm. That was the one-of-one journey to being where I am today, running Next Legacy.
Turner Novak:
When you talk about that Super Bowl team, a couple guys made the Hall of Fame. Is there anything they usually do differently? These top .1% athletes being the top .001%. What separates those people?
Ryan Nece:
I spent a lot of time trying to sum up the qualities I found in great athletes, elite founders, and elite investors. Could I sum it all up into one word? The more I thought about it, I came to this one word: theyâre thoughtful. If you think about the last time somebody impressed you or gave you a gift, that person was really thoughtful. They did something above and beyond. They did more than table stakes. They had an attention to detail.
The elite athletes, their desire to be great, to constantly improve, to feel almost that theyâre inadequate in areas, means theyâre constantly tinkering and iterating to be better than they were. This quest to be excellent in every area, not one area but in totality, itâs awesome to be around. To be around alphas and people that pursue that is inspiring and motivating. Those are things I noticed from elite athletes that Iâve tried to carry into a lot of the way I approach my life.
Turner Novak:
When you meet athletes just getting into investing, maybe theyâre still playing, transitioning out, is there a common approach you see? What are some of the biggest mistakes people make when they first get into it? They get really excited. What usually happens?
Ryan Nece:
The gameâs changed a lot since I started. It was really hard, I see Bill Gurleyâs book in your background, itâs really hard to get in front of Bill Gurley. That wouldâve been really hard back in the day. Now you can DM somebody, get to somebody through LinkedIn. You can navigate to people a lot easier in both directions. So athletes are approached all the time, and athletes now are trying to figure out how to navigate to get in front of the right people.
What you learn is a lot of athletes now, they have a guy. Every time I talk to an athlete and describe what we do, they go, âOh, I got my guy. My guyâs in tech.â And you go, âOh, cool, where?â âHeâs at Google.â âOkay, thatâs a good company.â âYeah, heâs at the Lincoln, Nebraska office at Google.â And youâre like, okay, he might be a little removed from the epicenter of where the actionâs happening.
So the athlete hasnât developed enough experience to have the discernment on who to spend time with. Thatâs one of the bigger pitfalls, developing the discernment on who to really trust. Not just taking the DM because somebodyâs got a huge following, or because the guy works at a company youâre familiar with but youâre not sure what that person does there. Because at the end of the day in venture, itâs why our logo is what it is, it comes down to the quality and caliber of people you can work with, partner with, and trust.
One of the things we think about at Next Legacy is our desire to line up with common men and women that have an uncommon desire to succeed. You have to be around a lot of people to have the discernment to understand whatâs uncommon. The more athletes can do that, the more theyâll approach this profession in a way thatâs professional. Hopefully weâre starting to see more athletes approach this as part of their portfolio.
Itâs not something thatâs just a side hustle, because thatâs where a lot of folks get in trouble. Maybe they send somebody else to take all the meetings representing them. Those are recipes for disaster. When the individualâs actually showing up to the meetings, spending time, engaging, and learning, thatâs when you see folks really make strides.
Turner Novak:
Itâs almost like you canât have a guy. You almost have to be the guy yourself, right?
Ryan Nece:
I would say both are true. You have limited time as an athlete, especially while youâre playing. But you can spend time learning, showing up, and engaging. You may have to have an advisor or supporter that can help translate for you, help you understand the vocabulary and nuances, be an intermediary. But that person shouldnât be the only sole representative on your behalf. The more the individual can do it on their own, by all means. If you had the opportunity to work with athletes, youâd rather that athlete come sit down with you than an advisor sit in that same chair.
Turner Novak:
All things considered, if itâs me and one other person, if itâs LeBron James or some random person no oneâs heard of, LeBron James probably makes me look better too. So why not?
Ryan Nece:
Thatâs the part where itâs a slippery slope for athletes. Because the last thing you want... we have thousands of athletes that have traversed the Next Legacy community. As a former athlete, one of the things Iâm always adamant with our team about is we never want to be in a position where weâre exploiting an athlete, leveraging an athlete on our behalf. Thatâs where you see it happen a lot. The athlete goes, âOh, that personâs trying to help me out.â No, that personâs trying to elevate themselves at your expense. So youâve got to be really transparent. The more athletes understand that, the better representatives and partners theyâll pick.
Turner Novak:
Is there a question youâd ask, or a single thing youâd look for, to suss that out and qualify it? One of my favorite tricks when youâre working with an agency is my single question is usually, whatâs your client retention? Whatâs your churn like? If itâs âno one ever churns,â you go, âOh, they must be great.â But if they donât answer, itâs because everyone leaves. Is there a good way to think about that as an athlete?
Ryan Nece:
Yeah. âHave you done this before?â might be the first question. Oftentimes the athlete finds somebody and itâs their first time working with an athlete in that role, and you go, well, whatâs the motivation, whoâs this really for? So one, have you done this before? Two, if you have, are you still working with those individuals? And three, why do you want it? Whatâs the plan, not just the plan for today. Like great founders, theyâre thinking three, four, five years down the road. Help me understand that picture. Then you can hold that person accountable to the plan.
Turner Novak:
Is there a single biggest investment mistake or worst decision youâve ever seen an athlete make when they first make the jump in? Weâre clip farming right now, essentially. Iâm like, what is the biggest mistake that someone listening is like, âHoly shit, that was bad.â
Ryan Nece:
Thereâs a lot. You think about the environment athletes are in. Theyâre around nightclubs, restaurants, hospitality, lifestyle businesses, and Iâve seen a lot of athletes put money into those buckets. Or they put money into things that stem from, âI just want a quick flip.â Anytime itâs quick, itâs probably going to disappear as quickly as it went in. Anytime somebody shows you a short window to make a lot of money with a quick fuse, those are recipes for disaster and red flags.
Turner Novak:
On fees, one thing I usually tell people is look at how this personâs getting compensated. Look at where the fees come in, how much they are. There are a lot of cases where Iâm getting paid a ton of money upfront and then I donât do much work after. There always needs to be some compensation upfront, but you really want it so the person only makes money when you make money. Hopefully the more you make, the more they make. The incentives should be aligned.
Ryan Nece:
Itâs a great point, having aligned incentives. When thereâs a misalignment, thatâs a red flag. To your point, if somebodyâs taking a lot of money up front and then promising theyâre going to do the work, historically that isnât always the case.
Turner Novak:
Are there ways youâve seen athletes help founders? When an athleteâs investing in a startup, is there a proven method of, this is probably the value you can add, versus donât do these other things?
Ryan Nece:
Every athleteâs a little different in what they bring and their value proposition. They might have a massive following and notoriety, and they can use that to create distribution and amplify, to be an ambassador for that company. They can be a connector, because of that network, their ability to get in front of a customer or leader or partner that companyâs been working hard to get in front of. An athlete can help open doors.
The part thatâs underestimated is an athlete has navigated some of the most chaotic, complex environments and can make quick decisions. They understand the intangibles to achieving a goal. So being a sounding board for that founder, how do I deal with the complexity of building a company. Sometimes just a word of encouragement, inspirational messaging, helping that founder push through. Itâs amazing what an athlete can do there.
A lot of founders have advisors. So how that athlete can be an advisor and trusted consigliere is really important, because thereâs this shared language of a desire to achieve the impossible. An athleteâs been told their whole life, âYouâre never going to be a pro athlete.â Most founders are told, âThatâs a dumb idea, thatâs never going to work.â And yet somehow these two individuals navigated the daily grind to make the impossible possible. When they spend time together, thereâs this camaraderie and an iron-sharpens-iron connection. So a lot of athletes can play a role there.
Turner Novak:
A lot of people donât realize, when youâre playing professional athletics, youâre in the NBA, itâs not like youâre just dribbling a ball and shooting. Youâre playing chess while working out at peak performance for two hours. Youâre thinking a lot while exerting your body. Itâs multidisciplinary, multitasking at the extreme end, because everyone else is also thinking, how am I playing defense, how do I reposition based on how he just repositioned. Itâs not easy. Iâve never done it, obviously.
Ryan Nece:
But you played hockey, right? Itâs like the Wayne Gretzky quote: âDonât skate where the puck is, skate where the puck is going.â Well, how do you know where itâs going? You reflect on your past experiences, you understand the present situational moment, and then you forecast into the future. Athletes are doing those three things constantly. And a founder is absolutely doing that constantly.
Turner Novak:
I always reflect back, I used to just be really, really fast, thatâs all I was good at in hockey, and now Iâm not that fast anymore. So Iâm like, man, if I could think as smart as I am now as a 35-year-old but still skate as fast as I could at 17, I would be so good.
Ryan Nece:
Another premium in our industry is speed. In athletics, speed is a premium, they tell you, you canât train speed, youâre either fast or youâre not. And whatâs amazing about these elite founders and investors is their processing speed, their ability to make quick decisions with imperfect information. Those are signals we look for when Iâm trying to identify people we want to be around.
Turner Novak:
I do want to talk about that, but I want to hit on this now. In venture capital thereâs this thing called the power law, where the vast majority, the numbers are always different, but something like 90% of the returns come from a small subset, like 5 or 10% of the companies or funds. Is that similar to sports, you feel like?
Ryan Nece:
Yeah. Stanford just put out a study on venture returns, and it was exactly what you said: 90% of the returns in venture over the last 10 years have come from 5% of the venture funds. Just a small number of elite managers that generate that alpha everybodyâs looking for. And if you look at the odds of becoming a professional athlete, itâs a very small number. Roughly 25,000 men have ever played in the NFL, and over half of them never played longer than three and a half years. It looks like thereâs a lot of people playing pro sports, but relative to the population it is a power law. Itâs an outlier.
To do that consistently at a high level is even harder. It shows up, think about Lewis Hamilton. For a long time, if you were going to bet on F1, Hamilton was your driver, one or two every time. If you were betting on tennis, for a long period it was Novak. Then it was Sampras. Even within the elite elite, thereâs still a power law of the dominating consistency certain athletes have over the rest of their league. Thatâs when itâs really special.
Turner Novak:
So in that sense, if youâre an athlete thinking about it, when youâre investing in founders itâs like finding the most elite person in the league, whoâs the best player or the best team, and thatâs ultimately who youâre trying to back when youâre investing in startups.
Ryan Nece:
Yeah, 100%. And I said Sampras, I really shouldâve mentioned Federer, because Federer is one of the GOATs. At the end of the day thereâs like 10,000-plus companies started every single year, but it comes down to only around 10 to 20 that really are going to matter from one year to the next. And itâs how do you actually get access, how do you find ways to do that? If youâre an athlete navigating this world, the best thing you can do is, success leaves clues, go study and be a historian of this industry. Understand the power law, understand where Sequoia ranks and where Union Square ranks, and Andreessen, and Amplify, and why they continue to perform at the highest level, so you understand who you want to partner with.
Then study the iconic companies. Why do certain companies continue to outperform? Think about what Meta and Zuckerberg... the guyâs just getting started. People forget, heâs still young.
Turner Novak:
Heâs barely 40, right? Is he 43?
Ryan Nece:
Early 40s. Some people didnât even start their careers until then. To find individuals like that, there are plenty of what I call supernovas out there that are incredible, that if you can be around them and find ways to partner with them, thatâs where youâre going to develop whatâs really needed in this game: the appropriate taste buds. I joke all the time, growing up, if I went to Sizzler, man, I thought I hit the lotto. A Sizzler steak and salad bar, I was like, this is incredible. Thatâs what I knew. Over the years, Sizzler might not be ranked quite as high as it used to be for my palate, because Iâve been exposed to other places.
I think a lot of this game is you have to hone and calibrate your taste buds so you can find and be around the most elite companies and people in this industry.
Turner Novak:
I know you did it through osmosis, joining your dad in these meetings. How do you recommend athletes when theyâre first getting into this, if they canât do that? A lot of people donât have that close proximity. What would you recommend if somebodyâs listening and is like, âThis sounds cool, I want to do this.â What should they do right now?
Ryan Nece:
Itâs one of the reasons we created a fellowship program, because a lot of athletes would ask that. Athletes can apply and go through a week-long program to learn the nuances of venture. Really itâs to develop context on where to put your energy and who to trust. So people can apply that way. The other way is the traditional ways, going back to school, finishing your degree or going to business school, and depending on your city, finding a way into the entrepreneurial and venture hubs.
Reading. There are tons of blogs. Find the best firms, and who in those firms is prolific putting out content. Andreessenâs got a ton of content. Union Square, Fred has a ton worth the read. Starting to collect clean, good data from high-quality people will put you on a direction to becoming more curious about where you want to spend your time.
Then you have conferences, TechCrunch and others. I used to nerd out, Iâd go to CES every year. If youâre a gadget guy, to go see and touch and feel the hardware and technology of the future, that was awesome. I was always surprised I didnât see more athletes there, maybe I was the only nerd doing it. But those are places you can find yourself into unique rooms.
Turner Novak:
One thing thatâs always surprising to me is people donât use the products before they invest. That blows my mind. You can just go try it. Anytime Iâm talking to a founder, whether itâs software or even some cybersecurity thing, I always try to use it in some capacity, because you might try the thing and it sucks, and if it doesnât work you canât make a business there. And if itâs an incredible product, other things are probably good too. Youâve got to at least try the product.
Ryan Nece:
Youâve got to try it. And an interesting thing, Iâm surprised how often an athlete wonât just Google. Let me just Google Turner before I connect with him. Do a little diligence, reference checking, before I spend time with somebody. Same with a product. Use the dang product, because if you donât like it, chances are a lot of other people arenât going to like it either.
Turner Novak:
So maybe talking more about Next Legacy. What is the firm? You have a couple different strategies. How do you describe it to people?
Ryan Nece:
Next Legacy sits at a very unique intersection of the world of the most elite venture capital firms and technology, and philanthropists and athletes and iconic cultural luminaries. We sit at that intersection to bring these groups together. We do that through our investment funds. We have three core strategies. We have a traditional fund-of-funds strategy where weâre investors in some of the most iconic blue-chip, access-constrained managers. We have an emerging manager strategy where we identify alpha-generating diverse managers raising Roman numerals I through III. And we have a dedicated co-invest strategy to invest alongside our top-tier managers.
We try to find a way to bring a truly differentiated value proposition. One, our flagship fund, we donât charge a carry, which is crazy in our industry. The reason is a lot of our investors are philanthropists. For everybody thatâs part of that fund, they are directing their proceeds to a charitable cause, a DAF, an endowment, a foundation. We too, as GPs, give away all of our earnings in that fund to charitable causes.
Over the years, weâve distributed back over $3 billion to different organizations around the world that are making the world better. Iâm very proud of that work. At the same time, we have this unique value proposition of these winners and champions and elite athletes from all sports that are part of our community. Our ability to bring value to our GPs and founders, leveraging the assets we have to go behind the scenes in the world of sports. That can be anything from being at the finals for the FIFA World Cup, to getting a private conversation with a coach to navigate what heâs looking for when recruiting an elite athlete.
Weâre constantly trying to take what weâve learned in sports and that community, and push that toward our founders and GPs to bring value. So thatâs a lot of what we do.
Turner Novak:
Howâd you decide to essentially give away all the money you should be making? Most VCs listening would be like, âThatâs insane.â How did you decide to do that?
Ryan Nece:
Great question. Legacy Venture was started by a gentleman named Russ Hall in â99, and they had that model for their existence. I started Next Play Capital in 2014, and in 2020, the two firms joined forces. Legacy joined Next Play and brought that model with them to continue to grow the work. So the credit goes to Russ and the original founders at Legacy for coming up with that model. Weâve continued to adopt it because itâs so powerful. When we show up and work hard and pursue excellence, to know weâre doing it on behalf of some of the most amazing organizations that are trying to eradicate homelessness, cure cancer, support our Olympians, provide eyesight to kids across Africa...
Man, weâre so inspired by the people whose capital weâre stewards of. Itâs what fuels me, itâs my why. When we started our firm, I didnât know much about being a venture capitalist. I didnât know how much money Iâd make or the ins and outs of starting a firm. All I knew was I wanted to meet a need. I found there were a lot of athletes and people that didnât have a seat at the table that wanted to be in the room around the best of the best. I felt we could create something that gave athletes and philanthropists the opportunity to partner alongside the most iconic folks in this game. That would fill my spirit, thatâs something I could get out of bed for. Ignorance is bliss, I didnât know everything I was getting into, but there are no dull moments.
Turner Novak:
On that note, the ignorance, was there anything you messed up early on? Biggest mistakes when you first started this?
Ryan Nece:
All of it. Itâs the constant iteration of how youâre pitching and who youâre pitching. One thing, youâre talking to LPs, and some will string you along, constantly ask questions, take information, and then ultimately not do anything. So I learned to be disciplined with my time and respectful of othersâ time, so we could get to yeses and nos faster. Finding the right people to get advice from, people have different motivations for why theyâre trying to help you.
One of my bigger mistakes early on was not spending enough time on the stuff behind the scenes as an investor when youâre building a firm. You have to set up all your support, legal, compliance, fund administrators, making sure youâre in those weeds as much as youâre searching for the next investment. That stuff matters. Weâve had to unwind things and change things up to get it straightened out. Those probably couldâve saved us a lot of time and money. But you learn along the way. Thatâs the joy of building something from scratch.
Which is why I also have founder paranoia constantly. Iâm always realizing weâve got to push to be better, cross our Tâs and dot our Iâs, keep evolving, not let competition catch us. I call it MF territory, the delta between where you are and where you think you should be. As a founder, you always think you need to be further along than you are. The advice is youâve got to look back at where you came from and have gratitude, to console that MF territory in your mind.
Turner Novak:
Where do you think you should be? Right now, when you think about that three-to-five-year gap, what ground are you trying to cover?
Ryan Nece:
We have a pure mission, and our mission isnât achieved. So you start there, thatâs why you have lofty missions. When we think about our ability to amplify the returns of our philanthropists and athletes to do good in the world, weâve got a lot more athletes and philanthropists to cover and support. The other thing is, like anything, you have scoreboards. We always want to make sure we have the highest scores, from performance in investing, from our LPs continuing to show up, from making sure that when people come into our office and interact with us, they come back to that word I said at the beginning: that was really thoughtful. Those are the standards we constantly have. Weâre doing great, and we can continue to be better in a lot of areas.
Turner Novak:
One of the things you mentioned was the evolution of the pitch. A lot of people donât realize, if you have a VC firm you have to go out and raise capital. Itâd be awesome if that $4 billion was all your money, but youâve got to raise it from people. So how did that pitch evolve? What was it like initially? Did you get pushback like, âAthletes canât do this, this is a bad strategyâ?
Ryan Nece:
You mustâve sat in some of my meetings. A couple things. One, because Iâm unconventional and not institutional, my language, my delivery, my approach was probably more casual than others. So I had to learn how to institutionalize the presentation so it could land in the ears of people used to hearing more institutional presentations. And I had to learn to ask the right questions. Itâs one thing to talk, itâs another to learn to have the other people talk in the room during presentations.
Turner Novak:
Was there a big one you missed out on, that you go back and ask every time?
Ryan Nece:
I ask this question almost every time. âItâs a pleasure to meet you, thank you for your time. Before we wrap up, can you walk me through your process of what it takes to get to a yes? Who needs to be in that decision process, and whatâs your typical timeline?â It seems like a no-brainer, but now you have information on how to think about that LP. Sometimes the person youâre talking to isnât even the right person. âOh, youâre not the decision-maker, youâve got to talk to four other people before this gets greenlit.â
So learning sales. Everybody should learn sales, because in this game youâre constantly trying to share and sell what youâre doing. Part of it is developing an authentic narrative, something true to you, your story, differentiated, thatâs a powerful way to connect through all the noise. Thankfully now we have a track record we can point to. But at the beginning, before the track record, a lot of people had to learn to trust me as a person. To do that, I had to demonstrate the body of work of why other people had trusted me. I had to mitigate their risk of feeling like they were going to be the first person to trust me. The more you can mitigate that for an LP, especially raising your first fund, the better chances youâll have.
Turner Novak:
Itâs usually not like you meet someone and they just give you $10 million at the end of the meeting. Itâs a long process, right?
Ryan Nece:
It is a long process. Part of that is realizing it. Giving yourself that timeline. âGreat, Turner, we had a great conversation,â but in an hourâs time I know youâre not giving me $10 million. That means itâs on me to continue to stay engaged with you in a thoughtful way thatâs not annoying, courting you along until we establish trust that you want to be part of what weâre doing. And GPs, because weâre LPs investing in a lot of funds, sometimes GPs donât understand the dynamics an LP is juggling. Portfolio construction. Are they at the beginning of deploying out of a fund or at the end? All those dynamics change how that LP thinks about investing in your fund. The more you can gather that information, the better sense you have of how to partner with them.
Turner Novak:
I know you do the fund where you do a lot of emerging manager investing. How do you approach that? Whatâs the general strategy? A lot of people are probably listening, âTurner, youâve got to ask him about this.â Whatâs the more tactical, nuanced strategy of that fund?
Ryan Nece:
The emerging manager fund was designed to take advantage of a long history of investing in emerging managers. Weâd always done that as part of our core fund, we had what we called discovery checks, smaller checks in emerging managers, and hopefully those managers would graduate up so we could write bigger core positions in our flagship fund. What we realized is a lot of our investors wanted exposure to these smaller micro managers.
Turner Novak:
Why do they want exposure?
Ryan Nece:
Because what weâve learned is alphaâs really been generated from managers out of two buckets, a barbell effect. Itâs these blue-chip, iconic managers that have moats around them, the ability to continue to attract and win the opportunity to invest in great founders. And then you have this other bucket of micro, smaller alpha-generating managers that have a particular expertise and niche focus. Maybe a differentiated network, maybe connected to a university. But theyâve also been able to generate alpha. The challenging part is thereâs so many of them. I think we did diligence on 430-plus managers last year, deep diligence. Thereâs a ton of managers out there, and a lot more than the ones we diligenced.
So to know who to invest in and whoâs going to return capital, thatâs a lot of work for larger LPs to figure out. A lot of investors want exposure there, but may not have the bandwidth, time, or energy. The other challenge is many are larger LPs, and to write a check into a $50 million fund, theyâre prohibited, theyâre not going to write a check smaller than $20 million, and they have rules preventing them from being more than 10% of a fund. So LPs wanted exposure to that group. They felt we had a track record and a way to identify managers that could put meaningful points on the board.
A couple things. One, you want to look at somebody that can actually grow and scale a business. Itâs one thing to be an investor, itâs another to do the work behind the scenes, the minutiae of growing and building a team so you have a firm thatâll be around for more than one vintage. We spend a lot of time on that. And this community is small, so excellent people want to hang out with excellent people. Generals want to hang out with generals. You can get a pretty good sense from somebody, whoâs in your starting five. If you said, âHere are the five people I like to invest with, the five people I spend time with, the five places I travel to,â Iâm going to get a pretty good sense of you and your community.
So we spend a lot of time trying to triangulate around people and their opportunity to find ways into great, transformational companies. Part of that is using a lens of diversity to identify contrarian thinkers that are complementary to our blue-chip managers. Maybe theyâre in a geography our blue-chip managers are underexposed to, or they traffic in networks and communities where they have an edge. As the world of AI continues to commoditize information and data, having differentiated networks and a broad, deep community of world-class people around you is edge.
We talk a lot about this, we started talking about it four years ago. There are two forms of AI that are important. Thereâs the artificial intelligence everybodyâs fascinated with, that weâre all reaping rewards from. But the other for us is authentic interaction. My authentic interaction with high-quality people on a consistent basis, before it gets onto the internet and recorded and transcribed, I now have edge. Turner and I have had a conversation where now we can make decisions before the rest of the world has that. Thatâs an important recipe. So weâre looking for people that have differentiated networks and access to information others donât.
Turner Novak:
So how are you uncovering that? In a first meeting with someone, is there a go-to question or process you try to hit on?
Ryan Nece:
I come back to being a little unconventional, and the young emerging managers listening, Iâm going to get hit up on this now, Iâm giving away secret sauce.
Turner Novak:
I mean, thatâs kind of the point of this. Weâre an hour in. People listening, these are the hardcore, theyâre doing research.
Ryan Nece:
Iâm going to try to understand you as a person. Understand your why, the way youâre going to approach this craft. And Iâm going to give you a sense of when I think about iconic people in the industry, my barbell of folks like Bill Gurley and Byron Deeter and Jim Goetz and Aileen and others I have deep respect for, the way theyâve approached their craft. Those are the bars, how my taste buds have been calibrated. So Iâve got to recognize, is this somebody Iâve got to spend more time with? Those are the things I work on in a first meeting.
Turner Novak:
Is there anything thatâs tipped you over the edge? When you think about the 430 youâve done a ton of diligence on, I donât know how many you invested in, Iâm assuming single-digit percent, whatâs usually in that small percentage where youâre like, âWeâve got to back these guysâ?
Ryan Nece:
What I love about our team is the diversity in the room when weâre making an investment. The RIC is filled with folks that have a different way of looking at a manager. When you bring the combination of how we all look at a manager, we come up with really great decisions together. The way I get excited about somebody might be different than others. But some advice I give to young emerging managers, thereâs this rule of three. If I had a conversation with Turner, we hit it off, got through an hour meeting. And then two days later I saw you at a private dinner with other people I respected. Thatâs the second touch point. And then all of a sudden, if somebody I have deep respect for pinged me and said, âHey, have you met Turner? Iâve really enjoyed working with him, you should get to know him.â
All of a sudden my antenna is up. Because Iâm using imperfect information and triangulating different data points to get to a decision in a short period of time. So I call it the power law of three, or the three touch points, and it resonates with LPs. You canât really engineer it artificially, but if thereâs a way to authentically do that, it lands with LPs. Thatâs why warm handoffs still go a long way. Getting warm introductions from people is a good thing.
Turner Novak:
Sounds like rule of three, and also the time box. Itâs not like this happened three years apart, it sounds like within a pretty short period where itâs almost like everyoneâs talking about these guys, and Iâve got to meet them.
Ryan Nece:
Yeah. Back to what I didnât know early on, I didnât realize how much LPs gossip. LPs are constantly gossiping, especially during annual meeting season, because theyâre interacting at all the annual meetings and sharing notes. âHey Turner, whoâd you meet with? Who are you talking to?â Youâre sharing information, and they reference check. âHave you talked to Turner about their fund? Weâre looking into it, what are your thoughts?â They use each other as trusted sources and sounding boards to validate what theyâre seeing. So the more you can get information out there in the whisper networks, the further that goes.
Turner Novak:
How do you operate the whisper networks effectively? I canât be like, âHey Ryan, can you start a whisper secret about me?â Whatâs a good way to get people talking about you? What makes you mention someone, or actually remember it, because you canât really fake this stuff?
Ryan Nece:
If I knew the exact secret sauce, Iâd do it more myself, because we need to be better at helping people understand who we are. What Iâve learned is if you can be top of mind for people. âOh, Turner? I know Turner.â How you stay top of mind in a noisy, busy world is different for everybody. But this comes back to a philosophy we operate by, that my family lives by: a giving hand is never empty. The more you give, the more comes back to you. The more you work with other elite people and help them, why am I sending a deal to Bill Gurley? I just believe it comes back. The more you do that on a consistent basis, and itâs authentic and youâre really invested into the ecosystem, that goes a long way.
Iâm a big fan of Adam Grant. He has a great book called Give and Take that I give out to almost all my athletes. Itâs this reminder that in the short term, takers can win, you can win because youâre doing something transactional. But in the long run, and venture is a long game, itâs the givers that find ways to succeed. So thatâs a philosophy we really live by.
Turner Novak:
One other philosophy I think your mom taught you is you always want to pick the kids that get picked last, or something like that. I probably butchered it, but that doesnât sound like a good strategy. If Iâm in gym class trying to pick the best kids for my team, thereâs probably a reason they were picked last. So whatâs the thinking around that?
Ryan Nece:
It was really a lesson about being aware of others, making sure you see other people around you. I came home one day from school, and my mom asked, âHow was your day, whatâd you do?â And I was bragging about playing kickball, telling her how great I was, kicking the ball over everybodyâs head, scoring all the points. And she goes, âOh, how does it work?â I told her, âIâm the captain because Iâm the best, and I pick the next best players, and you build your team and win.â And she, my momâs always been really crafty with her questions, she goes, âWell, are there kids that donât get picked?â And I go, âYeah, of course, the ones that arenât any good.â She goes, âWell, if youâre as good as you say you are, you should pick the kid that doesnât get picked first and then build your team. Because if you can win with them, then youâre actually really good.â
And I took the bait, because I didnât know what she was doing. I remember the moment I picked that kid, and the way it made me feel in my soul, seeing another human being seen and lifted up. That stuck with me, that all of us have the ability to look and say, thereâs probably people that are overlooked, that arenât getting picked. Just to acknowledge that other human, âHey, I see you.â If thereâs something I can do to be helpful, or just saying hello, it can go a long way. So thatâs the lesson I took from that, Turner. My mom gets a lot of credit for that one.
Turner Novak:
I feel like thereâs a lot of times where somebody just needs that inspiration, that external positivity. Maybe the kidâs always picked last, so he hates the thing because nobody wants him. Iâve had that personally. In college we were in the investment club, and I thought it was awesome. You pick a stock, you buy it, it goes up, you make money. I got really into it, and the guy who was president was graduating. I hadnât thought Iâd try to be president. One of my friends whoâs older than me, he was graduating, and heâs like, âYouâve got to be the next president of the club, youâve got to run.â I was like, âI donât know,â I hadnât thought about it. And he pushed me to do it. I ended up running and won the election. I always come back to that, it probably set off a chain reaction in my career, and I almost didnât even think of doing it. It was just my friend who was like, âYouâve got to do this, youâre the guy who should run.â It was a ten-second comment on a field trip. We went to Chicago to Morningstar and the Fed, and it was awesome. And heâs just like, âOh yeah, you should run.â I was like, âWow, yeah, maybe I should.â
Ryan Nece:
Itâs a great point. Regardless of how successful we are, we probably have some imposter syndrome or insecurities. And when another human gives you a little pep talk or word of encouragement, âNo, no, you should do that,â and gives you a glimpse of hope, that is game changing. It can get you over the hump and send you on a trajectory you had no idea you were going to go on. It doesnât take a lot. And being authentic with it, your friend was genuine and had conviction, and youâre like, âOh, I believe this, Iâm in, I can do it.â
Turner Novak:
Everything in life has some social element. Going against the grain, whether itâs internally what you think or what society says you should do, you really just need a little bit. Being the only person that tries something new, if you have a little encouragement. So youâre investing in this company with a founder, youâre like, âDude, youâre putting data centers in space, sounds crazy, but I think itâs a good idea, go for it.â Thatâs the push.
Ryan Nece:
100%. When youâre embarking on something where everybody else is like, âI donât know about that one,â youâre an outlier moving in that space. Itâs reassuring that youâre not crazy when somebody says, âYeah, youâre on the right path.â I give this guy credit, thereâs a gentleman named Samir Kaji who runs a company now called Allocate. When we first got started at Next Play, he was one of the first people. Iâm trying to do this, and he became our banker. He said, âThis is how youâre going to do it.â And I said, âYouâre right,â and I believed him, and it sent us on this trajectory. Having people around you that are part of your starting five, that have a level of expertise that can speak into you, is really important.
Turner Novak:
I have to ask you about this, because my brothers are going to kill me if we donât talk about it. You were on the Lions, the 0-16 team. We grew up in Michigan, we grew up Lions fans.
Ryan Nece:
Oh, man. Weâre going back again.
Turner Novak:
What was that season like? Going through that, it had to be hard on the team.
Ryan Nece:
It was extremely difficult. They fired our GM during the season. We had players on contract that they just sent home. âHey, donât show up anymore, just go home, weâll keep paying you because youâre not even worth being in the locker room anymore.â
Turner Novak:
Geez, I didnât even know you could do that.
Ryan Nece:
Neither did I. I think we had four or five quarterbacks that year play and start.
Turner Novak:
Yeah, I remember that. That was the year the guy ran out the back of the end zone on the Sunday...
Ryan Nece:
Dan Orlovsky. Yeah. Whoâs a great guy and a great commentator, doing an excellent job on TV now. We had to get Daunte Culpepper off the couch and come out of retirement to play quarterback. We were doing anything we could. And the challenging part in Detroit was the negative sentiment and environment compounded on itself. What happened is you lost belief. There were games where I remember us being up 21-nothing and weâd still lose the game. It was like you were waiting for the shoe to drop. It felt like the team didnât have belief that we deserved to win.
Iâll never forget, I remember at some point saying, âThereâs no way today can be worse than yesterday.â And that question started coming up in my mind around week three, and it happened every day since. Each day got a little worse, and we ended up losing every game. And I learned a lot. Actually, thatâs where I learned the lesson about Next Play, and I give my father credit. I remember reaching out to him around week five or seven, because there were plays happening, and for the first time in my career I was dwelling on the mistakes I made. Three, four plays were going by and I couldnât break the funk. I felt like I was in a slump.
I remember asking him for his advice, and he walked me through how in his career, the most important play was the next play. It didnât matter whether he made a mistake or did something good. The next play was where his mindset was. And I remember asking him, âHey Dad, when you made a mistake, tell me what you did wrong and how you got over it.â And he goes, âWhat are you talking about?â I go, âYou know, when you messed up.â He goes, âI never messed up.â
And I was like, âOh my gosh. This is why I donât ask you for advice.â Iâm like, âGood play or bad play, just tell me what you did to move on.â Heâs like, âThatâs the whole point, Ryan. The play didnât exist anymore. It was over, it was gone, forgotten about.â So it didnât happen in his mind. Heâs literally still in the next play. Having that mindset to move on, thatâs why we named our firm initially Next Play. Whether in sports or business or our personal lives, our ability to process the situation, good or bad, and move on is really important.
Iâve gotten myself out of a lot of bad situations with my wife and mistakes Iâve made, because Iâve learned to process and forgive and say Iâm sorry and say I messed up. And hopefully she listens so I can get some brownie points, because I had the Next Play mindset and just moved on. When you dwell too much in the rear-view mirror, you forget about the front windshield thatâs giving you a glimpse of where youâre going. Youâve got to look out ahead and not behind.
Turner Novak:
Any hard thing in life, playing a sport, starting a company, running a company, everyone sees the external headlines, but nobody sees under the hood. You had 100 people say no before one said yes. You lost 100 games, got injured six times before you made it. You go 0-16, you had losing seasons, you got traded because you werenât good. Nobodyâs just successful at every single thing.
Ryan Nece:
No, itâs a continuum. I think Bradyâs talked about, itâs not losing, itâs learning. Youâre constantly in this state of learning and growing and iterating. The hardest part is to maintain confidence and conviction even during a sustained period of downtime. Thereâs a book by Napoleon Hill called Three Feet from Gold, that reminds me a lot of people get so close to their goal, and then they give up just before the opportunity, usually at the hardest moment. Some of the similarities between elite athletes and elite founders is this mental toughness, this ability to have a high pain tolerance and feel comfortable in the most uncomfortable environments. That mindset lets them keep moving forward, suspending disbelief and the reality of the situation, because they keep believing.
Turner Novak:
In that book, or how you personally approach it, is there a trick or tactic for that, the never stop believing? And also, how do you know when maybe itâs not worth it, you need to stop believing this and try the new thing?
Ryan Nece:
In life, we go through tests to strengthen our testimony. The more tests we go through, the stronger our testimony. Itâs a testimony we look back on that gives us the strength to push through present obstacles. So one trick is to remind yourself of what youâve done, what you went through, how you overcame. Sometimes we forget the five broken collarbones and how we kept moving forward. Youâve got to look back at that.
The second, for me, Iâm constantly working on my mental toughness. Every month I pick a very small task. It might be writing a letter, opening doors with my left hand, brushing my teeth on one foot. But every day I have to do it.
Turner Novak:
Are those all ones youâve done?
Ryan Nece:
Yeah, for an entire month. And itâs really hard, not hard like the task, brushing my teeth standing on one foot. The hard part is reminding yourself to do it every single day. When youâre late, you just want to get into bed, thereâs a distraction, thatâs when youâve got to stay committed. Thatâs how I play with my mind and know there are going to be moments in my business and career and life where things get really hard, and itâd be easy to be like, âIâm out.â But hopefully I can remind myself that if we stick with it, we can get to the other side.
Turner Novak:
I wanted to ask about this. When you sold your company to Fox, I think you were an analyst for Fox for a little bit. What all did you do, and whatâs that like being an analyst for a sports network?
Ryan Nece:
Loved it. It was covering sports. I was a color analyst and got a chance to sit in the booth. Craig Bolerjack...
Turner Novak:
So this is covering the games.
Ryan Nece:
Covering the games, commentating. And I did sideline, and then studio work, pre-game and post-game shows, halftime shows. So I got a chance to do a little bit of all of it. Jacob Ullman at Fox, I give him a shout-out, gave me the opportunity to do that. I really enjoyed it. And you talk about anxiety and imposter syndrome, right before the camera turns on and goes live, youâve got all these thoughts going through your mind, I was always so nervous. Once the camera goes live, you lock in, and you realize there is no turning back now. No do-overs. You just have to stay the course. I learned a lot about presenting through those experiences.
Turner Novak:
Do you have to watch the game differently? Because you kind of have to entertain people that are watching.
Ryan Nece:
What it gave me a deep appreciation for, as a player, you show up to the stadium, get your uniform on, do your warm-ups. The amount of production and effort behind the scenes to bring a game live to television is crazy. I wish Iâd known that more as a player, because I wouldâve shook every single personâs hand. Theyâre there two days in advance, the camera crew setting up, getting the truck set up, the crews there hours before the game doing rehearsals. All of that is incredible.
And then when youâre watching the game, you realize not everybody has the same expertise you have. Talking at a detailed level about the intricacies of the game probably isnât fascinating to 90% of people, when they just want to know, was it a good play or a bad play? So being able to talk about what happened in an easy, concise way, and also give color. âThe reason Turner is so good at podcasting is because of his background and where he lives in Ann Arbor. Itâs an environment that gives him solitude and allows him to reflect, and heâs a reader. Thatâs why he can show up and do his job.â You give context, and it elevates who that player is and makes them more human. Thatâs the part I loved, getting those backstories and sharing them with the audience.
Turner Novak:
To that point about the podcast, when youâre listening to a podcast, you sit and wait for the next thing. Versus when youâre the one on the other side, I have to say something interesting now. I canât zone out, youâre not on autopilot, you have to engage in a conversation.
Ryan Nece:
Youâve got to ask a question. Whatâs my next question? Iâve got to be ready. Thatâs the hardest part about doing interviews.
Turner Novak:
And the hardest part is when youâre talking through this live, Iâm like, âDo I keep talking about this thing? I have a couple questions I could go to next, which one do I jump to? Do I tie back something he said earlier? How do I make it interesting?â If Iâm going to change topics, how do I bridge from sports to investing to the lesson you learned from your mom? I actually did want to ask you what itâs like to commentate a game, because to me thatâs interesting.
Ryan Nece:
Thatâs a great point. All of a sudden youâre talking about the offense and why itâs so impressive, you built up the show in advance, the quarterbackâs amazing, the receiverâs amazing, and then none of that happens. The quarterbackâs a dud, the receiverâs dropping balls, and now youâve got to shift the arc of the story and your narrative in a way that ties things together, and where it doesnât make you look like an idiot. âWait, you told us at the beginning this offense is amazing.â Doing it live is easier said than done. When youâre doing interviews, to tie things together and direct the conversation so all your audience, why you have such a great audience is people have learned to listen to how you navigate these conversations and keep everybody on their toes.
Turner Novak:
So when youâre playing the game and itâs not going how you think, you have a game plan of, we know these guys love play action, we know they have this, and they just donât do it. How do the adjustments happen? Are the coaches scrambling, motioning things? Can you only adjust between quarters?
Ryan Nece:
Ooh, thatâs a good question. The amazing part is the amount of information youâre taking in in a very short period to make quick decisions. As a player, youâre getting information from your sideline, from your coaches, from the other players, âWhat are you seeing?â Youâre getting information from the offense: what formation are they in, whoâs in the game right now. Youâre getting information about the period, is it the third quarter, fourth quarter, are we up big, are we behind? All those variables help you anticipate whatâs going to happen next so you can prevent that offense from advancing.
Iâll never forget, this was the first year Iâm starting on this defense, next to Warren Sapp and Derrick Brooks and John Lynch. Iâm like, âIâm starting, baby, this is amazing.â And weâre playing the Carolina Panthers. This defense was known as the Tampa 2, that Monte Kiffin and Tony Dungy came up with. It was unique in that historically it wasnât good for stopping the run, but because of our players we stopped the run. Weâre playing the Panthers and Stephen Davis, and they came out in a very basic formation. Iâm lining up, and all of a sudden I see the play. I know exactly whatâs going to happen. I see Stephen Davis get the handoff. I go, âI know where heâs going, this is going to be awesome.â And I take off, and I vacated my responsibility in the gap I was supposed to be in, because I want to go make a highlight.
Well, as soon as I put my foot in the ground to get outside to where Stephen Davis was going to go, Stephen Davis put his foot in the ground, made a cut into the gap I vacated, and took off down the field. Next thing I know, weâre all chasing Stephen Davis, and Iâm hearing Warren Sapp cussing me out, âRyan Nece, you blah blah blah,â as weâre running to chase him. And I said, this is incredible that, one, Iâm going to get cussed out and Iâm so embarrassed I didnât do my job. Two, how the heck does Warren know it was me that wasnât in his gap? Thatâs how detailed he was, everybody on the team knew during a play.
Think about it. You watch a play, how does one even know that? Thatâs how detailed he was to understanding what was going on.
Turner Novak:
Thatâs insane, because he probably has the play memorized in his head. He knows where the guy got through, whose fault it was.
Ryan Nece:
Exactly. And it was mine. I had to own it.
Turner Novak:
On that note of top athletes, do you have a favorite athlete of all time that youâve admired, respected, learned from?
Ryan Nece:
The answer is yes. Itâd be easy for me to say my father, and a lot of people would say Iâm crazy if I donât say him, but actually it was Jerry Rice. I think about Jerry Rice because he truly is the greatest wide receiver, the greatest offensive player of all time, the GOAT. Jerry had very humble beginnings and developed a work ethic unlike anybody else that had ever played sport. My father had incredibly high standards of the way he worked, and he always talked about how Jerry superseded his own work ethic in some ways. Getting a chance to know Jerry and learn about all the things he did away from the game, and then to see how that hard work showed up and made him incredible, I always had a deep appreciation for him.
Turner Novak:
So what did he do? What were some of the things that really stood out?
Ryan Nece:
At practice, and this is practice, guys catch a ball and run a few yards. He wouldnât just catch a ball, heâd catch it perfectly, and he wouldnât run just a few yards, heâd run all the way down to the end zone and score a touchdown every time. Every time. This is 30, 40-plus catches a practice. He wouldnât just jog it down, heâd sprint. And any time he saw a line on the ground, heâd do this little cha-cha with his feet over the line, just to constantly work on his footwork. Heâd run these hills here in the peninsula and ask people, âCome work out with me.â Everybody would tap out, and heâd just keep going, not for an extra five or 10 minutes, heâd be gone for the rest of the day, just constantly working. Incredible stamina and drive and mental toughness.
Turner Novak:
Thatâs like an example of, you catch a slant in a game, do you just stop because you caught it, thatâs the end of the play? Or do you keep running and try to score every play? You should be trying to get a touchdown every single play.
Ryan Nece:
Itâs a mindset. This idea of, I talked about being thoughtful. He was so thoughtful about who he wanted to be and how he wanted to show up that he was willing to have the mindset that every time I touch the ball, Iâm going to score, and Iâm going to practice that.
Turner Novak:
Does he still have records? Wasnât it most receptions in a career, or most yards in a season?
Ryan Nece:
Most yards in a season, most yards in a career, most receptions in a career. Maybe most touchdowns too for a receiver.
Turner Novak:
Heâs got all three, I just looked it up. Most career receptions, most yards, and most touchdowns. And maybe Googleâs lying on this, because the AI stuff hallucinates a bit, but it looks like he also has, for career, regular season and postseason, most receptions, yards, and touchdowns in the postseason too.
Ryan Nece:
Yeah.
Turner Novak:
Thatâs peak performance.
Ryan Nece:
Indeed.
Turner Novak:
Do you have a favorite founder, or CEO, or business, or historical figure that youâve learned the most from or get the most inspiration from? Recent, from history, anythingâs fair game.
Ryan Nece:
These are two different individuals Iâve always admired. One, Abraham Lincoln, heâs not necessarily a founder, but I consider him one. I think about his humble beginnings, his path to where he was, and how he led. Thereâs a great book called Team of Rivals about what Lincoln did after he was elected, to fill his cabinet with his rivals, because he felt to lead a United States he needed all the perspectives in the room. I always admired his career and the decisions he made.
The other, from a business side, is my grandfather. My grandfather ran five restaurants that he helped start. He taught me about customer service. He made me pick up a penny anytime I saw one on the ground. He made me pick up all the trash at the restaurant, clean the bathrooms, do all the little things and attention to detail, to learn the business, but to learn hard work. My grandfather paid for everything in cash, he didnât believe in credit. He had disciplines that gave him the ability to live a successful life. He passed away young, but I learned a lot from him, very simple, sound, disciplined beliefs about running a sound business. It started with just doing the right things, like picking up trash. We all walk over a piece of trash, âsomebody else will pick that up.â Heâd pick it up.
Turner Novak:
Well, this has been a lot of fun. Thanks for coming on the show.
Ryan Nece:
Thank you for having me, buddy. I appreciate it. I know we covered a lot.
Find transcripts of all other episodes here.
Access gets you in the room. Judgment determines what you do there.
When information and connections become easier to access, the advantage shifts to knowing whom to trust, which opportunities deserve attention, and whatâs worth acting on.
Access creates options. Discernment determines their value.
The "having a guy" trap is the biggest leak in athlete wealth. You outsource the relationships and the learning, then wonder why you have no leverage in the room. Own the relationship. Learn the language. Show up yourself. That's the difference between being sold deals and building equity.